New roses for old
There's a rose I'm fond of, but which is twenty years old and definitely flagging.
Can I perpetuate it successfully with cuttings? i.e will the new plants behave like new young roses and have a twelve-year lifespan, or will they behave like a twenty-year-old, like the old mother plant ?
Slightly confused are you asking how long the new roses from cuttings will survive as new plants-why do you think 12 years?
I'm told twelve years is how long you can expect a rose to survive and thrive before replacing it. I'm wondering whether cuttings from it, once established, will behave as new plants, and survive and thrive as such, or whether they will be inferior, having come from a 'spent' mother plant, and therefore not last the normal span.
In other words is it worth taking cuttings fron a plant that's had its day, or will the plants produced be inferior and short-lived?
There will be posters here who will tell you they have had many a rose last longer than 12 years as have I-this is news to me
You will be creating a new plant so it will live as long as it lives- as do all cuttings from any other plant-a rose will not be any different-why should it be?
I'm just wondering where you've got these times from. Many roses last a lot longer than twenty years - I have have several which are much older, and thriving - and if a rose was past its best at twelve years I'd be amazed.
If your rose is flagging, prune it well next year, and feed it well as well as giving it a good mulch. Make sure that it doesn't go short of water, and you should see a significant improvement.
This is the first year I've tried taking cuttings from my roses, I took 7 about 6 inches long when I pruned it back from 2 different rose bushes (pink climber and red gift rose). 3 of the cuttings are happily growing away in a corner before they go off to my sister in laws garden up north, the other 4 haven't done anything yet but I haven't lost anything if they don't root.
You may as well try taking cuttings when you prune the bush back in the autumn, we all love free plants and it's really easy especially as you'll be cutting the plant back anyway.
Thank you all. Your prediction was correct, Sotongeoff! Alina, my local Wyevale Garden Centre, and my David Austin Roses catalogue both indicate that after twelve to fifteen years roses won't perform so well and will need replacing. Certainly all my oldest ones ( twenty years plus ) though pruned every year, do not produce an abundance of flowers as do the younger ones - which seems consistent with that advice. I have taken successful rose cuttings, and as you say, Leggi, there's no point not doing so, but I was simply wondering whether taking from really old plants would mean their offspring were less vigorous /robust /long-lived. One thing I'm a bit haphazard about is feeding, though. Next year Alina, I'll feed regularly and see if i can rejuvenate the golden oldies.
Naki - I have a similar quandary. I've been rejuvenating a garden for the past 3 years which had been badly neglected. There are half a dozen old roses which to my knowledge have been there for well over 25 years. I was reluctant to interfere with them in any way and for 3 years have dilligently pruned, fed, mulched, watered, sprayed at the first sight of aphids etc. To no avail. I don't know which roses they are. All have about 3/4 very tall thin stems and after yearly pruning to a third of height, they shoot up in the Spring to full height, produce only one or two buds and at this time every plant becomes covered in powdery mildew and I end up having to cut off almost all of the leaves. When the buds flower they only last about a week and they always seem too heavy for the spindly thin stems. Consideration for the previous gardener made me reluctant to dig them up but this year I've given up on imagining that any of these roses are going to be any different. I've dug up three, reluctantly, and for the ones which are left I had wondered, like yourself, if any cuttings taken would actually be strong enough to root as these roses look absolutely exhausted.
Dear me, I've seen some bad advice before but.......A few years ago I was in Tombstone, Arizona, where I saw the World's Largest Rose. It was massive and 150yrs old. The World's oldest Rose Bush is at least 1,500yrs old and grows alongside Hildesheim Cathedral. My own garden has 73 roses and I expect them all to outlive me. Provided the soil is good and well composted, the bushes are correctly pruned, fed and watered, they can and will live for years. When we moved here eighteen years ago, we inherited some very old and gnarly roses. With proper treatment all have responded with fresh healthy growth and flowers.
I should have added that very occasionally they will wilther away and no effort would save them. Roses particularly dislike sandy soil for instance. So the time comes when they may need grubbing up and replacing with a new rose. Roses also dislike being planted in the same spot as an old rose so either dig a big hole and replace the soil with fresh stuff taken from elsewhere in the garden or sink a cardboard box in the ground and fill this with fresh soil. Cuttings? I find those of mine taken on October work best. 9" tall and placed in a tall flower pot in a 50/50 mixture of GP compost and vermiculite. Allow a full twelve months to produce a good root system then pot on into individual pots. 18 months to two years and they are ready to grow into the ground.
My reply to Yarrow2 seems not to have been added to the forum. His experience exactly mirrors mine.I preferred to consult a forum as I'm a bit suspicious that advice from a garden centre might be coloured by their desire to sell more plants!! However, as there doesn't seem to be categorical advice about the predictable performance of cuttings taken from old bushes, I shall consult with a few garden centres and if I get useful advice, I'll add it to this thread.
Thank you for all comments.
Watch this space !