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How should we fund Social Care?

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  • Lizzie27Lizzie27 Bath, SomersetPosts: 8,513
    I agree with you @Fire.
  • JoeXJoeX Posts: 1,698
    I don’t think it really matters which tax pays for what - that’s just political manoeuvring to see what the electorate will stomach.

    Taxation is not fair, it never was and it never will be.  It’s just about what can be extracted from the citizenry without them rioting in the streets.

    Any idea that pitiful amounts spent by MPs is even a drop in the ocean of money we’re talking about is entirely fanciful.

    Its also nice to think that you could find social care by trimming back here and there (consultants etc) but that’s also a laughable idea.

    We’re talking stupid amounts of money. We either decide to pay for it, or we don’t. No one else will.
  • EmerionEmerion Posts: 388
    Raise NI significantly, and also raise the starting threshold to protect those that couldn’t afford it. 
    Carmarthenshire 
    If at first you don’t succeed, have some cake. 
  • FireFire LondonPosts: 12,134
    edited September 2021
    Taxation is not fair, it never was and it never will be.  It’s just about what can be extracted from the citizenry without them rioting in the streets.


    How do we fund the collective? Health, wellbeing, education, sanitation, infrastructure? You don't agree with progressive taxation? 

  • The amount of tax in total we pay is freighting, approx..

    65% for a Lower rate tax payer 

    82-83% ish for a higher rate payer.

    That’s once you factor in all taxes, (income, NI,VAT, CT, CGT, road fund, insurance premium tax, etc etc etc)

    If we need to generate more money for social care, basic and lower earners need to contribute more. 

    We can increase the higher rate a bit…but there isn’t a whole lot there before they’ll decide it’s just not worth it and move to the lower tax bracket…. 


  • JoeXJoeX Posts: 1,698
    Fire said:
    Taxation is not fair, it never was and it never will be.  It’s just about what can be extracted from the citizenry without them rioting in the streets.


    How do we fund the collective? Health, wellbeing, education, sanitation, infrastructure? You don't agree with progressive taxation? 

    Your first two points are not a logical progression from mine. Tax pays for them. I neither agree nor disagree with progressive taxation, whatever works. I think it’s nice of me to pay more tax than someone else, but that is the opposite of fair.
  • KT53KT53 Posts: 5,933
    Purely on the point about a house being used to fund care, there is certainly unfairness, perceived or otherwise, when you can have a situation where two people who have had similar incomes throughout their lives are treated totally differently.  One has bought their own home and been careful with their money, the other lived in rented accommodation and spent every penny they have earned.  The latter will be 'looked after' by the state, the former will get nothing.
    In the long term, a percentage of earning to be ringfenced for the NHS and Care.  Yes it's a tax but there is nothing to prevent the bar being set comparatively high to avoid it hitting those on low income.
  • Hostafan1Hostafan1 Posts: 30,428
    why doesn't everyone pay the same rate of NI? Why does it go from 12% below £50K to 2% above?
    Devon.
  • BenCottoBenCotto RutlandPosts: 3,278
    Your figures don’t look right to me @vanguard.

    According to the Institute for Fiscal Studies, the poorest 20% of households spend 11% of their gross household income on direct taxes and 26% of what’s left on indirect taxes.

    For the 20 - 40% cohort it is 13 and 20%
    For 40 to 60 it’s 17 and 19
    For 60 to 80 it’s 20 and 17
    and for 80 to 100 it’s 31 and 12.

    Incidentally, 30% of income tax receipts in the UK come from the richest 1% of us. The bottom 50% contribute 9.3% of the pot.
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