Rawl plug too long or vine eye thread too short?

marcos 114marcos 114 Posts: 24
edited April 2018 in Tools and techniques
I bought some vine eyes to screw into a brick wall to train an espalier. The recommended rawl plugs were for 7mm holes, but they look too long. Looking online most plugs don't seem to specify their lengths, so wondering if I'm using the wrong thing?

I've lined the base of the thread up with the end of the plug, and it doesn't get near the bit that the screw normally pushes out to secure the jagged bit (which I bet has a name).

I wondered if I should try and just cut the top of the plug off, but as you can see it splits into two.

Generally, the thread of the vine eye seems quite short - but they all look like that online (and these were sold by the same vendor that sold the espalier, so I'm sure they are the right thing).

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  • BobTheGardenerBobTheGardener Leicestershire, UKPosts: 8,014
    edited April 2018
    Drill the hole just deep enough so that you can insert the rawlplug fully then screw the vine-eye into it as far as it will go.  More than the threaded part of the vine-eye will go into the plug.  This is normal.  The split part of the rawlplug will expand when the eye is screwed into that section to tightly grip the inside of the hole and it is only this section which provides any strength.
    Follow steps 1 to 4 here:
    https://www.wikihow.com/Use-a-Rawl-Plug
    then screw in the vine-eye.

    A trowel in the hand is worth a thousand lost under a bush.
  • Drill the hole just deep enough so that you can insert the rawlplug fully then screw the vine-eye into it as far as it will go.  More than the threaded part of the vine-eye will go into the plug.  This is normal.  The split part of the rawlplug will expand when the eye is screwed into that section to tightly grip the inside of the hole and it is only this section which provides any strength.
    Follow steps 1 to 4 here:
    https://www.wikihow.com/Use-a-Rawl-Plug
    then screw in the vine-eye.

    Thanks @[email protected]

    I'd figured it was the jagged bit that was necessary, hence considering cutting off the other bit - but the jagged piece would very nearly be two separate pieces then.

    You mean like this? I think that only leaves me 60mm off the wall for the espalier, which I'm worried is not enough. 




  • ObelixxObelixx Vendée, Western FrancePosts: 17,905
    60mm will be fine.  It's enough to allow air to flow and also to tie stems in.
    "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw
  • BobTheGardenerBobTheGardener Leicestershire, UKPosts: 8,014
    Yes, that's it @marcos 114.  As Obelixx says, 60mm is plenty of space.  It's important that the eyes are held firmly in the wall as some climbers can get really heavy and wind-load can be high.  It's best to drill the holes into bricks rather than the mortar between the bricks (assuming a brick wall.)
    A trowel in the hand is worth a thousand lost under a bush.
  • marcos 114marcos 114 Posts: 24
    edited April 2018
    Darn it

    Seemed to be ok until I tensioned the 2mm wire - seems to have bent quite a bit in the plug, maybe the wall plug is too big? The instructions said to us a 7mm drill bit. It's not hugely tensioned at the moment.

    Start again with a smaller wall plug? I went to the depth suggested - so there's only 60mm vine eye poking out.
  • Although - I just tried unscrewing the vine eyes, and they are indeed bent, rather than moving in the hole... I really didn't think I put that much tension on. It's a 4m span end to end, and the middle of the wire moved easily.
  • ObelixxObelixx Vendée, Western FrancePosts: 17,905
    50mm is fine.  Try screwing the vine eye in further if there's movement.  

    If it's stable, just carry on but make sure you have at last one, preferably two eyes spaced evenly between your two ends to pass the wire thru and maintain the distance from the wall.  Just doing the ends isn't enough at that distance.
    "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw
  • marcos 114marcos 114 Posts: 24
    edited April 2018
    Obelixx said:
    50mm is fine.  Try screwing the vine eye in further if there's movement.  

    If it's stable, just carry on but make sure you have at last one, preferably two eyes spaced evenly between your two ends to pass the wire thru and maintain the distance from the wall.  Just doing the ends isn't enough at that distance.
    But should the vine eye itself bend like that? I thought it might just be moving in the hole, but it's actually bent.

    I'll add another couple of the eyes along the span. I feel like I'm failing at something quite simple!

  • Done - I think I was just tightening them too much - as it's thick wire, there's still little bumps in it, despite it still being taught.

    I ended up putting the vine eyes every 1.2m

    Thanks @Obelixx & @BobTheGardener for the advice.





  • ObelixxObelixx Vendée, Western FrancePosts: 17,905
    Well done.
    "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw
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